SPOILERS Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

[Tonyblack]

**Warning**

This thread is for discussing Wintersmith in some depth. If you haven’t read the book then read on at your own risk – or, better still, go and read the book and join in the fun.

For those of us that are going to join in the discussion, here are a few guidelines:

Please feel free to make comparisons to other Discworld books, making sure you identify the book and the passage you are referring to. Others may not be as familiar with the book you are referencing, so think before you post.

Sometimes we’ll need to agree to disagree – only Terry knows for sure what he was thinking when he wrote the books and individuals members may have widely different interpretations – so try to keep the discussion friendly.

We may be discussing a book that you don’t much care for – don’t be put off joining in the discussion. If you didn’t care for the book, then that in itself is a good topic for discussion.

Please note: there is no time limit to this discussion. Please feel free to add to it at any time - especially if you've just read the book.

And finally:

Please endeavour to keep the discussion on topic. If necessary I will step in and steer it back to the original topic – so no digressions please!

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Wintersmith by Terry Pratchett
Originally published 2006

When Tiffany Aching can’t keep her feet still, she joins in the Winter Dance and comes to the attention of the Wintersmith. He’s determined to make her his queen and bring about a never-ending Winter.


When I first read this book, I thought that Terry had lost the track of the Tiffany books. It was by far my least favourite of the series. But the more I’ve read it, the more I’ve come to like it. I still wouldn’t say it was my favourite in the series, but I like it a lot more than I did.

This one is about taking responsibility for your actions – if you make a mess then saying ‘sorry’ is not going to solve the problem. Tiffany has to deal with the mess that she made and put everything right again. She’s really growing up in this book.



Want to write the introduction for the next discussion (The Fifth Elephant)? PM me and let me know if you’d like to – first come first served.

 

[poohcarrot]

I think this book is a classic example of "Carrot Syndrome". Once a character reaches perfection then the only way for that character to go is downhill.

In the first two Tiffany books, Tiffany could do no wrong. It was like she almost had super powers. Yet in this book she suddenly becomes stupid. Not only does she stupidly dance in the first place, but also for a lot of the book she acts like a big "girlie".

When I first read this book, I thought that Terry had lost the track of the Tiffany books. It was by far my least favourite of the series. But the more I’ve read it, the more I’ve come to like it. I still wouldn’t say it was my favourite in the series, but I like it a lot more than I did.

Couldn't agree with you more Tony!

And I'm sorry to say that Horace the cheese is totally unnecessary and simply not funny!

 

[mystmoon]

Although, to be fair Tiffany is at that age where you find yourself doing stuff without meaning to, although I do agree that it seems a strange lapse in character for her.

And how is Horace not funny? I loved his bits (although that may have been Daft Wullie as he always makes me laugh)

 

[poohcarrot]

Tiffany created Horace - a sentinent living thing. Apart from Igor, who else has created life in Discworld? (and I don't mean in the usual way )

 

[mystmoon]

UU rubbish dump probably could

 

[poohcarrot]

The UU dump didn't create life, only altered existing life. Plus it ain't a character.

 

[mystmoon]

Cheese has bacteria in which are alive. They could have been altered to give the illusion of a sentient cheese

 

[poohcarrot]

Who altered them?

 

[Jan Van Quirm]

My money's on Boffo! Could have been something to do with Miss Treason maybe?

 

[poohcarrot]

Of course! Miss Treason was using the cheese to see with, even after she was dead. How obvious!

 

[Jan Van Quirm]

Oi - you can leave off with the agreeing now thanks!

 

[poohcarrot]

I wasn't agreeing. It was sarcasm.

I should just have wrote, "Utter gibberish!"

 

[Jan Van Quirm]

But I do agree that Horace is a total waste of space - You is much better and she's got Greebo on the run too

 

[poohcarrot]

Oi - you can leave off with the agreeing now thanks!

 

[Tonyblack]

I think that Horace was included just for the one joke about cheese "humming". And that word doesn't even translate into American English as I had to explain it to Sharlene. I wonder if he'll be in the next book.

 

[poohcarrot]

I think the Bogles represent Sir Pterry's disease;

I hate things that try to take away what you are. I want to kill those things, Mr Anybody. I want to kill all of them. When you take away memories, you take away the person. Everything they are.

 

[Ponder Stibbons]

Very likely. Certainly gives the same creepy effect and in the same way when you think about it.

I think the feegles represent all her emotions; bravery(rob), fear(daft wully), thoughtfullness(gonagle), in-charge/jan-ness(hamish), etc. and all are presided over by fear.

 

[swreader]

Like everyone else thus far, this is not my favorite book but after 3 or 4 reads I think it has some quite good parts. I also think, however, that this is the first book in which Terry's Alzheimer's shows up in various ways. For one thing, it's not nearly as well written as the earlier books (eg. Horace the humming cheese is a totally unnecessary and not very useful intrusion, IMHO).

And Pooh, Tiffany DOES NOT knowingly create a sentient being as far as I can tell. She simply creates various cheeses among which is a Lancre blue. It does seem to have unusual veining--and activities, but there's no indication that she tried to do that.

And why isn't Horace painted black like all the other cheeses?

 

[poohcarrot]

Like everyone else thus far, this is not my favorite book but after 3 or 4 reads I think it has some quite good parts. I also think, however, that this is the first book in which Terry's Alzheimer's shows up in various ways. For one thing, it's not nearly as well written as the earlier books (eg. Horace the humming cheese is a totally unnecessary and not very useful intrusion, IMHO).

And Pooh, Tiffany DOES NOT knowingly create a sentient being as far as I can tell. She simply creates various cheeses among which is a Lancre blue. It does seem to have unusual veining--and activities, but there's no indication that she tried to do that.

And why isn't Horace painted black like all the other cheeses?

Everyone seems to be agreeing with everyone.

But....did I say that Tiffany knowingly created a sentinent cheese?
Did BP knowingly create a big oil slick?

 

[swreader]

But....did I say that Tiffany knowingly created a sentinent cheese?
Did BP knowingly create a big oil slick?

Well, Pooh, you judge your own statement. I see no other way to interpret what you said except that you are saying she knowingly created a sentient being--and that she is the only one except one of the Igors to have created life in Discworld. It's nitpicking, I know. But what can you expect from a retired English Professor

Tiffany created Horace - a sentinent living thing. Apart from Igor, who else has created life in Discworld? (and I don't mean in the usual way )

And of course British Petroleum is trying to duck responsibility for the deaths of eleven people on the rig and limit its liabilitiy by saying that the deaths and the accident are the responsiblity of the company they hired.

British Petroleum is weasling by trying to say they'll pay for the oil damage. But the fact remains that they are responsible for the pollution of our Gulf Coast, the destruction of the wetlands, the probable deaths of millions of fish, birds, sea mammals and their habitat destruction, as well as taking away the livilihood of millions of people, and possibly introducing oil pollution into the Atlantic. How do you put a price tag on that?

Nonetheless, they're going to be on the hook for billions!!! of dollars. So the answer to your question about whether they knowingly created an oil slick (from the legal point of view) is that they knew or should have known (negligence test) that what they and the company they hired was doing was dangerously liable to create exactly what it did.